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  • Finally someone that think in normal life way.


    I agree with almost all of your points.


    I play League of Legends and i have a good performance cause i can play any time and play in any frequency (3 times a day, every day or 4 days each week... w/e.. i'm free to make my time!). And Travian doesn't allow it... U must play many times per day.. and every day.


    I don't agree with reward who login more (like a auction). But i agree reward who log frequently and finish all tasks offered. Like Daily quests. Travian could have Weekly quests too. Or more daily quest to "force" the player to stay more time online. But that actual system demand so much time that u don't need those quests. You lose much more than the Daily Quest if you don't play that day (resources on warehouse at max.. and many other things).


    I think Travian could focus more on "who make better decisions" than "who spend more time online" (i got many ideas to resolve this problem, but i'm tired to talk and don't see any Adm take the idea at serius.. I even tried to work as game design to them. Actually i work at programing games mechanics to other companies).


    You said everything when u spoke: "is straight up arrogance, and quite frankly pissing on a lot of players who prefer to play their own account alone." when talking about who suggest play with duals. All majority of players like to have their own accounts.


    Travian still have chance to get their players back. As i have seen, their are listening to the comunity, at least. But there a long far way to reach a "healthy game model" yet.


    The game must be focus on the "fun" and not on the "how many time u spend online".


    League of Legends is a perfect example of successful game that doesn't demand a high time to evolve (you can make your own time) and doesn't need huge investiment to play and have fun (actually, zero cost).


    Sure, Travian and LoL are two big diferent games.. But that's the point, the Riot (LoL's company) focus on healthy game models (matchs of 20-40 minutes.. Ranked system independed of how much time u spend online..). But Travian no. They focus on who spend more time and money (comparing 2 players with same skills).


    The only problem in LoL that's is similar to Travian is the Challanger League. Cause if 2 players have the same skills (same win rate).. the player who play more matchs will get more points. That demand much focus on playing. But that's the point... There are MANY leagues (Diamond, Master...) and the Challanger is the PROFESSIONAL league with VERY HIGH SKILL PLAYERS.. So if you don't play professional, don't need to "few bad" if you don't reach that league. U need to play very well and this demand dedication.

    As Wishmaster3 said, you can't be pro in any game without dedication. But that time dedication MUST BE about developing skills.. and not "grinding rank".


    You can't compare and say that One player with less skills is better than other with more skills, just cause that player with less skill play more time than the other. That's the point. Isn't a fair comparison.


    Sry the big text lol


  • I play League of Legends and i have a good performance cause i can play any time and play in any frequency (3 times a day, every day or 4 days each week... w/e.. i'm free to make my time!). And Travian doesn't allow it... U must play many times per day.. and every day.


    League of Legends is a perfect example of successful game that doesn't demand a high time to evolve (you can make your own time) and doesn't need huge investiment to play and have fun (actually, zero cost).


    Sure, Travian and LoL are two big diferent games.. But that's the point, the Riot (LoL's company) focus on healthy game models (matchs of 20-40 minutes.. Ranked system independed of how much time u spend online..). But Travian no. They focus on who spend more time and money (comparing 2 players with same skills).

    3 games per day!! You are setting aside 3 hours per day for games, more than you need to run an average travian account! And travian requires activity in different spots throughout the day, with league you dedicate an whole hour. Got to do something? Close travian. Got to do something while playing league? Enjoy your ban. The time commitment for league is HUGE

  • Challanger is the PROFESSIONAL league with VERY HIGH SKILL PLAYERS.. So if you don't play professional, don't need to "few bad" if you don't reach that league. U need to play very well and this demand dedication.

    Challenger isn't a professional league. Actually, it's also very comparable to running a top account on travian. You say that it takes a lot of dedication to reach challenger. Then what is the issue in it taking a lot of dedication to have the best accounts on travian?



    But that time dedication MUST BE about developing skills.. and not "grinding rank".

    League, as an example, is a lot about grinding rank though? Same goes for other similar games.


  • 3 games per day!! You are setting aside 3 hours per day for games, more than you need to run an average travian account! And travian requires activity in different spots throughout the day, with league you dedicate an whole hour. Got to do something? Close travian. Got to do something while playing league? Enjoy your ban. The time commitment for league is HUGE

    I can play each match at any time. And i know when i have 1 hour or 2 free. Especially when at night. So, i never got problem to "quit cause i have to out". This only happen who try to play before go work or before go to school. It's PURE about time management.


    Travian no.. If you will get a Attack landing at 5:00 am, and u just can effort at 1h or 2h delay.. U MUST login at 2:00 am to make the block.. Come on, you really want to compare LoL and Travian about the freedom they give to us? LoL make us much more free. It's obvious.

  • Challenger isn't a professional league. Actually, it's also very comparable to running a top account on travian. You say that it takes a lot of dedication to reach challenger. Then what is the issue in it taking a lot of dedication to have the best accounts on travian?



    League, as an example, is a lot about grinding rank though? Same goes for other similar games.

    League in his majority game model it's nothing about grinding. It's pure skill play. You just need play ranked like 1 time per month to keep your rank. Otherwise you will start to drop ranks. But come one.. 1 time per month? That's nothing. It's just a mechanic to avoid a "first place" stay there forever without play. Very well thought by the way.


    The EXCEPTION i said is the Challanger league.. cause the points scale very hard with Match Numbers (Win Rate is what matter, but High Win Rate doesn't keep you at top for so long if u don't have many games played).


    But as i said.. Challanger is a professional league. Who play there know that will play with professional players (Challanger it's a type of "curriculum" of LoL.. Many players get contration of professional competitive teams by his "name" at challanger rank. It's a way to open oportunity.. So yes.. who seek play into pro teams, will look for a good Challanger Rank). So if you don't play as pro.. don't need to be worry about don't reach challanger.


    I play as Diamond and i'm ok about the time i spend playing.


    Pay attention now!

    The big diference between Travian Matchs and League Matchs are TWO THINGS.

    1º - The Way to MEASURE the Skill play from players.

    2º - Match making level.


    explaning:

    1º - Travian measure the time and money u spend on it (with merge troops and auction, it's pure pay to win). LoL measure pure skill play.. Cause your Win Rate is what matter (even in Challanger.. with low Win rate you don't go far..). So League of Legends REALLY measure the player skill play.. Travian NOT.


    2º - Legue of Legends have a great match system cause with his great Skill Measurement, they can make a match with players of near play skill (ya, play skill, not Time or Money offer as Travian do). But Travian don't have a good Skill Play Measurement and make Match with no filter.. In other words.. Travian mix players with diferent time, money and skill play in a same match. When in a FAIR COMPETITION should only be evaluated the SKILL PLAY. And not players with more time and money.

    In the end everyone know that the top players in Travian are those with more Time to spend and more Money (in PTP, at least. And Lusobrasileiro servers), and MAYBE with more skill play. And u know why? Cause a player that have great skill play CAN'T WIN with few time or few money. So that's the point why Travian doesn't evaluate the players skill play.. They are limited by time and money.. And League of Legends doesn't make it (only on very high ranks.. in professional league).

    And here another thing. I know Master Players (before Challanger, like a "waiting room") that are VERY good and play as "casual" (2h per day, every day. And like 4h weekend). They are there for pure skill play. And Travian it's is possible? No.. cause Travian demand too much time.. and money.

  • How do you get to your rank, and how do you climb ranks though? By grinding 100+ games... How do you get good at the game? You need to grind games, to learn matchups, to train decision making, to improve mechanics. What will happen if you stop playing? Your mechanics will deteriorate.


    You can't really compare the two games, they're entirely different. Travian is not FPS, not MOBA, not any of those. There is for sure still skill involved though - but, of course, time is one of the most important factors. How would you make it about skill though? Automation doesn't show skill. It's not like we can implement that you have to aim the catapults like in a FPS or something, or control each of your units in battle like an RTS.


    But, to say that being a top player in other games is not about time and dedication too? Ridicolous. There are many people who will consider playing 18 hours per week of LoL a lot too.

  • The 2 games are completely different in many ways.


    The thing that makes Travian great is that you can "choose" how you want to play and even adapt mid-game. If you just want to be there, the play with friends etc. you can log in a few times a day and do what needs doing. You can have skype/discord/slack/whatever set up to notify you if anything needs urgent attention (def call etc.). If you have more time than usual, you can set up a farm list, adapt your account etc.

    I see Travian as a game of "mathematics". Yes, it does require strategy, but all in all, its about efficiency is just about anything you are doing. You can have a great account with little effort (as long as you know what you are doing).


    If you want to have "match-making style competition", I see the following comparisons: easy-mode (1x server), medium(speed servers), hard(qually/finals). Yeah, it also depends a lot on time and if you have friends/duals etc. But I always found the faster the servers, the harder they get/more skill they need.


    Personally, I dont like duals, since I havent clicked with a single one yet, so I stay on 1x servers and do my bussiness in peace and quiet :D

  • How do you get to your rank, and how do you climb ranks though? By grinding 100+ games... How do you get good at the game? You need to grind games, to learn matchups, to train decision making, to improve mechanics. What will happen if you stop playing? Your mechanics will deteriorate.


    You can't really compare the two games, they're entirely different. Travian is not FPS, not MOBA, not any of those. There is for sure still skill involved though - but, of course, time is one of the most important factors. How would you make it about skill though? Automation doesn't show skill. It's not like we can implement that you have to aim the catapults like in a FPS or something, or control each of your units in battle like an RTS.


    But, to say that being a top player in other games is not about time and dedication too? Ridicolous. There are many people who will consider playing 18 hours per week of LoL a lot too.

    1º Point

    Understand that: Skill Play is a result of time dedication AND your learning time eficiency.

    Someone who spend 8h per day and play WORST from who that play 2h per day.. It's cause that guy that play 8h has a WORST efficiency of learning.. And that's the diference between a "more skilled and less skilled" player... Time counts.. but the eficiency is what SHOULD matter (even in real life... if u work 12h a day and produce LESS than who only spend 2h a day.. Who u would contract? That's obvius. Got it now?).


    Now let's talk about the importance of the game to our lifes. The GREAT MAJORITY of people play just for fun... And many like compete FOR FUN too (like me). Compete in a casual way... So yes.. I want to COMPARE MY SKILL PLAY with players that are in same condition as me... To see who is better. Got it?

    But there some players that make the game their job.. And when you are working.. his playing... Now in real life example... Would have fun to play soccer against Neymar? You would always lose all games... You would think the competition would be fair? Cause you work with another thing.. and Neymar Work with Soccer.. Do you understand now the BIG diference between those players and why they shouldn't compete with each other? It's just unfair and no fun...


    So i don't want to play a game to be the best of the world.. I want to be the best in a casual or semi-casuel style. I want to be the best between those who spend 2h a day playing.. Not who spend 8h a day.. Understand now?


    2º Point

    Now talking about memory of learning and skill limit. When you learn to ride a bike.. Your forget it? Nope... Maybe when you spend A LOT OF TIME wihout ride.. maybe you have some lack of skill in the first moment.. And sure.. you will have a BIG LACK of skill compared with those ride bike every day. But all skill have a limit (basead on the complexity of the activity).. Some games need 8h a day to you know everything from the game.. other demand 4h.. Some school disciplines you take 30min to understand and some need 5 hour to understand.. Depend of your potential (skill) and the complexity of the task.


    I'll give a good example. If you start to play World of Warcraft now.. you will have to spend A LOT OF TIME to learn all the game.. Cause that game demand too much time to learn everything.. After you learn.. u just need to play "few hours" a day to keep your skill.


    Travian is a simple game that don't demand too much time to learn... But u need to spend too much time playing to "be good" (even being less skilled)


    League of Legends i stoped play for 6 months and came back.. When i came back.. i can say that i back with like 60% of my skills (just example). But now.. after 1 month playing every day.. i'm in the "top" of my skill again. I don't need to spend 8h a day to recover it. And that's the big diference about those games.. League of Legends demand more time of "traning" to u keep your skills ups.. Travian not (simple game). But Travian demand more time in other ways...


    So that's it.. There your capacity to HOLD YOUR SKILLS and your capacity to LEARN FASTER that will determine if you are best or worst than someone that spend the SAME time as you. It's not about time dedication... but how good you use it (even in your Job). That's what mean a good player/worker. The time that the people spend in each things is pure personal and depend of the Life Style or Objetive of each people. And a Game shouldn't get involved in it.


    I would agree with you if it would a really important competition (World competition).. Like World Cup.. World League of Legends Championship.. But those competitor WORK ON THAT. As i said before.. Would be fun play soccer against Neymar? I don't think so. The purpose of games to great majority of people are have fun.. So why compete to have no fun? U just stop playing.


    Important observation: Neymar is a mix of great talent and time dedication.. that's why are at the top of the world.. If he just had time dedication, wouldn't be on the top. And if he had only talent.. wouldn't be at the top too..


    It's all about FAIR competition.

  • Again, some people want their frequent login time to be rewarded, some don't.


    And that's it. Travian rewarded people who logged in more than who don't.


    And here is the flow:

    Customer suggest, Game Designer decide.

    That's business.


    Better for someone doesnt mean better for someone else.


    But if I take a look at this thread only, most people want their frequent login time to be rewarded. That's people choices.

  • You don't have a trustfull data on this post. The Travian team should make a Quiz or a single Votation to know that issue.


    You can't trust in the opinion of someone that say that is good or must be rewarded to wakeup 3:00 am to log into a game to do something cause that game demand it. And i doubt that the majority players like to share account..


    To you confirm that, u should have data. As you said.. Customer suggest, Game Designer decide. The problem here is that travian have a HUGE evasion of players (idk about Travian data.. but my personal experience show me that all friends of mine that played travian, already stoped..And i'm talking about more than 30 people. I stoped too... But i'm trying to change it, trying to suggest healthy ways to play this game).


    I'm done this post. U can't just defend sickness, it's already proven that this game is sick. Want know the comunity opinion? Make a votation, done (at least Travian team are making some votations now.. i hope their try this kind of votation.. about atomatizations, farm list pratice and Sending Troops number limitations). The game would be better to everyone with that. Those who spend more time and those who spend less time.. But in a fair way.


    I really don't care to the opnion of someone that want a unfair game, there's no fun to win that.

  • This is team game. Usually teams have more or less equal distribution of gold spenders/extremely active accounts. Your problem OxAriesxO is that you want to be a leading player on your team. Sorry, but these spots are taken by people who is willing to spend time and money on the top of their skills (most likely equal to yours). Travian is definitely not extreme in pay-to-win terms, the opposite actually. Neither it is extreme on time needed to play on competitive level, wishmaster3 explained well why.


    You want to play for fun? Play for fun. In any human activity someone who spends more time given equal abilities win.

  • This is team game. Usually teams have more or less equal distribution of gold spenders/extremely active accounts. Your problem OxAriesxO is that you want to be a leading player on your team. Sorry, but these spots are taken by people who is willing to spend time and money on the top of their skills (most likely equal to yours). Travian is definitely not extreme in pay-to-win terms, the opposite actually. Neither it is extreme on time needed to play on competitive level, wishmaster3 explained well why.


    You want to play for fun? Play for fun. In any human activity someone who spends more time given equal abilities win.

    So ok. Let's talk with DATA. Cause you guys can't see the other ways.


    Tell me, you think it's fair some that have tons of cache get a Culture Point Helm (idk the english name). in the first Day (it give 100 CP per day.. in the first day we don't have neither 80 CP/day with our 1º village). Just cause that guy could possible born rich? Or got a great job (no matter the reasons) and could spend like 2000 Gold (yes.. some times the Action go to this point) for 1 item? And this Item just make a HUUUUGE diference in your CP farm? (if u are good enough, u will know the importance of CP in the game begining).


    Tell me, you think it's fair?

    Wouldn't be more fair if u COULD NOT buy Silver with gold.. and just buy Silver with RESOURCES (Wood, Clay, Iron and Cereals)?


    Answer that... this is better than anyother arguments, cause it's the pratice. If you don't know.. CP helmt at the 1º day of Travian is a great game change.

  • I personally have no problem with it. We have never bought the shiny hat, yet, somehow, settling in top 10 every single server in last few years. And no, we are not shy with gold, just don't see a need to settle first instead of 7th, not gonna change anything in long run.


    The fact that there are people willing to spend a fortune on a game round means the rest of us can play with moderate spending. Running a server cost certain amount of money, if TG removes gold whales it would only mean that you pay more.


    I don't know how to break it on you, but 200K silver is not record for gladiator helmet, nowhere near it. And money spent on helmet is not most atrocious display of wealth in this game.

  • I personally have no problem with it. We have never bought the shiny hat, yet, somehow, settling in top 10 every single server in last few years. And no, we are not shy with gold, just don't see a need to settle first instead of 7th, not gonna change anything in long run.


    The fact that there are people willing to spend a fortune on a game round means the rest of us can play with moderate spending. Running a server cost certain amount of money, if TG removes gold whales it would only mean that you pay more.


    I don't know how to break it on you, but 200K silver is not record for gladiator helmet, nowhere near it. And money spent on helmet is not most atrocious display of wealth in this game.

    200k silver it's not record, is usually price on PTP server. At least on Lusobrasileiro (PT and BR).


    With 2k gold (200k silver) you can have Plus Account and +25% resources bonus for 2 servers 1x Speed. Or you can have 1 server (200 days) of all that, more Golden Club and still have 1000 gold to spend rushing Villages or using Art Power (PTP cost 5 gold minor power and 10 gold account power, 24h duration). So with 1k gold left, you can rush like 10 vilages with 100 gold (Main building to 20, Warehouse and Grannary at 10, and put all resources field from 7 to 10 instant (that's a great economic rush).


    So with 2k gold you can manage A LOT of your account. And here (in Brazil), it cost R$ 140 ,00. What it's aproximataly 14% percent of the "minimum wage" in Brazil. So yes.. If you spend 14% of a minimum wage to play for 6 month. It's ok. I gree with that, cause it's a accesible price. But some guys spend it on ONE ITEM... There are many other itens really relevants to be brought.. Like Cages.. Potions (you know that u can rush your Hero XP Level bu attacking Oasis very hard on early game, right? It make many player stay on top cause that.. with Health Potions u can just atack without a break...).


    The advantage that the Auction gives it's very abusive. Top players always do it. If you would wait 3 or 4 days to get a good Weapon or a Gladiator Helmet (as u said).. u would lose about 400 Culture Points.. It will keep you like 2 days delayed from those who will make the 3º village.. (the 2º village we get very fast with Tutorial.. Resources being the main constraint. But at the 3º village is it's about Culture Point).


    Well, the advantage of auction is insane. I don't ask for a "no gold server" cause it's too much. But a server with "no gold aucition" and "no gold merge" would be very VERY better and Fair. I would love play it. Auction is good.. Merge too, but can't put gold on it.. cause gold it's not a fair competition.

  • I SAID before: "If I take a look at THIS THREAD."


    I'm not saying most of the player. I'm not that big fan of Travian, so I don't really need to find out which one is the truth.


    Yes indeed, Travian need to have some surveys about that if they want the truth.


    Once again I'm telling this: "If I take a look at THIS THREAD." That is data, even if not sufficient enough to generate the conclusion, but still data.


    Thanks