Balance changes discussion thread

  • Huns best unit was unbalanced as well, mind you.


    While I am bothered Egyptian Waterworks effect still hasn't been halved, Steppe now merely carry less, while maintain low price, high battle power and high speed... tbh they're still a bit on the OP side.

  • Huns best unit was unbalanced as well, mind you.


    While I am bothered Egyptian Waterworks effect still hasn't been halved, Steppe now merely carry less, while maintain low price, high battle power and high speed... tbh they're still a bit on the OP side.

    You're focusing on a single unit when you should be focusing on the tribe as a whole. Hun steppe OP does not equal Huns are OP.

    ..And that is the Final Word.


  • You must be really biased to not understand that nerf. They are very overpowered, and they're still good even with that nerf.


    I agree with what Wolkenengel says, they actually didn't change anything about the Egyptians.

    Hey svenie, good to see you’re still around!


    I guess I am a yes, but I believe the Huns deserve it because the playstyle is so much more skillbased.


    Does this balacing mean we will see Egyptians/Huns at next years TT?


    Oud lid van: MAGNOX, IJsberen, BvB, Valkyrion

  • @mods: Are what we discussing just something among us? so that we talk about the implications rather than complain? or do what we say is going to make it to TG's ears so that we explain what stuffs are wrong and what has to be addressed etc from a very experienced player perspective?

    For TG: These changes were almost great till I kept reading on - all in all I believe, your train of thoughts are just plain wrong or plain stupid whatever you want to call it.

    Your objective should be simple: What's the most OP stuff right now in Travian? Answer: Wonder of the world (look at finals). Why? Higher shipment to the wonder possible due to the merchants bonus applied to the new patches. What did you do? You buffed both TO and Commerce bonus. And then with the buffed TS, so that resources can be gathered quicker too.

    Now - it would only make sense that the WWKs be buffed similarly - players get a GWorkshop or something, but nothing. For end-game off buff, only teuton rammers are there to against much higher defense. Though this brewery buff is more of a mid-game importance compared to the end-game. People have stopped chiefing wwks now a days, they rather zero pop them. And hitting random means nothing when you aim to bring down all the 40 buildings.
    Now where should you be headed right now? Preparing the new tribes for the classic server. So, Egyptians required some serious nerfs... Capital is unchanged (which might not be a bad thing considering the increased defense at the wonder - to make building wwks easier), but that wall!! With the increased def at wonder, and Egyptians wonder holders.... :|

    That also brings us to what Final Word said - the "weak" building was held by Gauls, not by teutons... :| Did you ever get a complain about brewery from the highest off producing tribe in trav?


    I also would like to point out to another post in this thread - the feature we ALL wanted from travian was "no defense to non-confed/naps. With exception of Wonder." We all keep writing about spiking - please make it to not be part of the game....


    PS: Thanks for the artwork change. Now everyone can buy instead of 1 player. It's like a must have item now, but also I'd point out - with this nerf to artworks, It is possible to have items be affected by philosophy bonus.


    Edit: Forgot to mention - it's good that the game is changing. Changes are good - new strategies should keep being figured out. Just please think about implication when changing. Sometimes something's already strong - which does not require additional buffs.


    i just want u to know i have no prob with u not knowing good English but don't act smart and use stuff i said that u don't even understand to try to hurt me bro

    Post was edited 1 time, last by fnx ().

  • So correct me if i'm wrong, right now playing gaul off you are making HUGE mistake. The worst mistake of all mathematical mistake. With teutons getting buffed out of the blue, you have to think if its even worth to play Rome off. But gaul... oh boy, why dont you just delete headuans and swordsmen.

    Rome has its horse drinking trough (+for attack points/hour)

    Teuton has its now crazy overpowered brewery (+for attack points/hour)

    And gaul can build a god damn traps.... (+for TG hating gaul offensive)


    But i guess gaul can have fun with theutes thunder with boots +50% they can reach radius of 200 squares in like an hour.... Its something.


    Also not a huge fan of 400% tournament square.. RIP my poor praetorians :( (a little buff maby?)


    But at least artwork nerf is CRAZY GOOD and many thanks for that TG.


    Increase of hero production is GOOD as well cause it will buff eco start so no longer teutons will have that much of a lead with farming.


    Dont really have more thoughts on the rest of changes.


    EXCEPT REWERT THAT TEUTONS BUFF THEY ARE ALREADY THE BEST OFFENSIVE TRIBE. Let everything else go BUT NOT THIS.

    Or keep it and change something my idea is that for every lvl of brewery catapults will not only fire at random but they will loose their power, at max 20% attack bonus they will loose 50% of their power, so 100 catapults will hit like there were just 50 of them.

    • Steppe rider nerf:

    Makes sense. I think it’s maybe a little bit too much, their carry capacity shouldn’t be hit that hard... but it should make romans more viable, so generally good.


    • Item changes:

    All completely fine. Artwork cooldown is awesome, and should have been implemented long ago already, but better late than never.


    • Resource production of hero:

    Fine, I guess. Kinda indifferent between just nerfing the production of Egyptian hero, or this buff of other heroes, but guess it’s fine. It was needed to nerf Egyptian bonus though, so that’s fine.


    • Philosophy alliance bonus:

    The buff to philosophy was sorely needed. Together with reduced cost, it’s still the worst bonus, but not as bad as it was.


    • Commerce alliance bonus and trade office buff:

    However, buffing the commerce bonus and Trade Office at the same time is overkill. Commerce buff alone would be fine. This very massive buff to merchants’ capacity makes cross-quad metas with a single WW more viable (less fighting on the server), and generally takes away strategic aspects of the endgame (proper pony express setup and so on).


    • Brewery buff:

    I don’t like it. If you want more people to play teutons, it’s the wrong way imo. Teutons aren’t underpowered as it is, so looking at their play rate is the wrong indicator for balance.

    Teutons already have the most off power per time, paired with cheap units = the best tribe for smashy OP hammers, that are meant to be used often. Teutons don’t need more power.


    Yes, it’s true that launching solo as a teuton, you had little incentive to activate brewery, if you wanted catas to hit specific targets. But paired with multiple hammers on OPs on the same target, there’s little reason not to run brewery and have the teuton be the first hammer.


    If anything, this is pushing the metagame towards teuton OP hammers almost exclusively building rams, leading the attacks in front of other hammers with catas (I have already seen this be applied in some instances, tournament, comx and that is with only the 10% brewery bonus) – I doubt TG considered this when deciding the buff. I’m not saying this is necessarily bad, but it’s likely not the intended outcome by TG.


    Teutons are also far the best WWRs, no contest whatsoever. This will just make the difference even bigger - and tbh I don’t think it’s really needed to buff WWRs. I can see a buff to WWK/WWR be needed on the tournament server, but imo not on normal servers. 20m+ WW def is still not common on normal speed servers, and I think teams should be rewarded for achieving large defenses too. A 600k rammer can still take down the wall from 20 to 14 or so if the WW defense is at something like 15m with LA, I don’t think it needs to do more damage than that.


    It also changes the balance with UA/LA - I don’t think UA needs an indirect buff - it is already important enough.


    • Tournament square buff:

    Wulfr101 covered it above mostly


    What I will add is - please don’t compare special servers to normal servers. The TS makes sense on the specials. Those servers are meant to be scrappy - you fight inside small regions with other teams. You have local defense that is sent/forwarded more or less as soon as incomings show up. Capitals aren’t as important as on normal servers (people might not have taken their final cap until later in the server, and might not even go for good 15cs, but rather 15c with no oases or 9c in strategic locations). Small cata armies are used, feeders are hit, troops are merged to hit with short duration, OPs don’t necessarily have the same landing time, and are done more battle group style.

    In normal legends servers, apart from the early game skirmishes with in-quad opposition, you’re fighting cross-quad wars. Feeders, unlike in specials, have little value. This means large-scale OPs involving 10+ sizeable hammers, with a specific landing time.


    Cluster settling will not solve these issues (and will make it even worse for defenders to get a proper cap). Having two defenders settle poor caps next to an offensive account, purely to protect that account, won’t make that hammer safe against 2-3-4-5 hammers, nor a full hammer train. Defense will still be required from elsewhere.


    It also seems like you’re basically encouraging tech accounts. Just make every offensive player have 4-5 defensive slaves that will only defend him, and do this for your whole team. Screw collective alliance defense -> boring, stupid, encourages multi-accounting, and why not raid those techs at the same time too, which is even more dumb.


    I will also elaborate a bit on why comparing praets at TS20 speed makes no sense. Yes, the most experienced and dedicated anvils will probably have TS level 18-20 in their main anvil village (typically cap). But you will be producing defense from multiple villages, and those other villages won’t have level 20 TS. Typically, it will be level 10-12, if any at all. Romans are forced to produce praets in multiple villages, due to the nature of their cavalry, otherwise they make no sense defense wise. Now, that is for the more experienced anvils… But what about the less experienced, or just less dedicated defenders? Those who are typically the greatest in numbers? They likely won’t have TS20, not even in their main anvil village.




    And then I have to agree with Final Word

    Egyptian oasis bonus is probably the single most requested nerf, but nothing was done.

    Nothing was done about Gauls special building.

    And, merging wasn’t addressed either.




    To close out this long-winded post:

    I am not against change. I’ve applauded some of the changes, and feel indifferent about some others. I think my above points make it clear I’m not against change in principle, but that I just take issue with some of the specific changes, for valid reasons.

  • Implications:

    I'll also go through the changes that would bring a change to the game before writing about what sort of game we're headed towards:

    1. Troop changes:

    Only Steppes change has an implication.

    I have a raiding index to calculate which troops are the best for raiding. (Movement * Carriage / training time). There's ofc more to it. Early game some units can go solo like EIs, Steppes, ECs, TKs, Marksman while clubs, TTs etc can't. But clubs are cheaper, and so is steppes for early game. So this is more of a phase where 24/7 training is possible. Who increases your raid/hr.

    Before this change, Steppes were the best raiders by 5.7 index. Followed by Huns Marksman horse at 5.0 index and finally EIs at 4.9. Now, however... Steppes get a 3.7 index :| After Marksman 5.0, EIs 4.9, TTs/Clubs at 4.3.

    Raid ROI: Steppes with a Raid ROI of 7.8 full bag trips had the best score after Huns Mercenary at 5.8 and Clubs at 4.2 full bag trips! But A LOT FASTER. Legions have a raid ROI of 8, but they're also much slower. Now, Steppes raid ROI is 11.9 full bag trips. Huns Marskman is 10 trips, EIs 14.1 trips and TTs 14.5 trips.

    What this implies is that Steppes are no more the primary units for Huns to start with. They should stick to the Mercenary and avoid the costs of stable/research etc etc.

    Opinion: This nerf was too big for Huns. As Final word said - overall tribe was not unbalanced. There is just one very OP tribe - and Egyptians is still there untouched. Off players are easily going to lose the incentives of playing this tribe. This tribe might only become a hamvil tribe from now on. With teutons brewery buff - and huns raiding nerf - I don't see why any off player should chose this tribe. For raiding def players - this is the best option.


    2. Hero Item Changes:

    Tier 3's earlier release is a good change - since it can result into building slightly larger wwks. It was a required one. Maybe even earlier what's the loss.

    Artwork once every 24hrs. Probably the best change implemented that everyone agrees with. Kind of wastes your efforts on spending resources to grow your empire when others pay a lot to get those items. Now, a lot of players will be afford buying it. A real balance change


    3. Hero Resource Production:

    A fine balance change. Considering the poor raiding troops of Egyptians - this might be a somewhat nerf in early game Egyptians.


    4. Alliance Bonus:

    Philosophy + bonus donation requirement was a required change. They were just too expensive. However, Commerce was already big enough - with this new bonus (as mentioned earlier), the wonder defense can just grow more since easier feeding... That's not where TG should've gone. This only has end-game implication and nothing else. It's not like in classic servers your villages are miles apart.


    5. Brewery:

    Sadly, this makes teutons the primary choice for attack players. While rammers were buffed already - now with the increased 20% off power to help in zeroing enemies, even Romans economic hammers might not beat it.


    at max capacity of 100k crops consumed troops (below calculations are at lvl 0 troops from kirriloid and considering Eis to eat 2, and Ecs to eat 3 to fill up the total 100k consumption)

    Imperians + EIs hammer: 8,195,738 off power (107 days single buidling, no helmets)

    Imperians + ECs hammer = 8,100,561 off power (99 days)


    Clubs + TKs = 5,167,283 off power (65 days)

    Clubs + Tks with brewery 20% = 6,865,645 off power


    Axes + Tks = 6,933,538 off power (85 days)

    Axes + Tks with brewery 20% = 8,320,245 off power

    (brewery 10% value for comparison = 7,626,891)


    In other words... Axe + Tk is the best economic hammer too. With a lot faster rebuild time specially when you consider that teutons rams and cats are gonna be stronger too.


    However, I also do like the teuton rammers change this brings.


    5. Trade Office:

    As mentioned above in alliance bonus changes for commerce - this is not a required change for classic servers. Our bases are not miles apart - and I don't think it makes sense to build bases like that in these servers either. This only has end-game implications. Even more buff towards the wonder.


    6. Tournament Square:

    Sorry wulfr :P I like this change. Travian 1x is slow server. It's a good change imo to make it slightly faster. A boost to res production would've been welcome too :P Though I do agree maybe it's coz I'm OC, a raider and I hate to do DC work :saint:But this change goes both ways.



    Game Changes:

    1. Stronger wonder:
    Definitely the biggest change. With the boosted res, possible to feed more def. And much much boosted NPC villages too sadly. Though with the confedracy restriction in trade routes - which might have lowered the shipment, this somewhat balances it again X/


    2. Rammers:
    Obvious one


    3. Economic hammers of teutons:

    Teutons are now the choice tribe for all aspects of off hammers except for raiding oriented. Economic, cheaper, faster to rebuild, higher off points. Only at Raiding - EIs hammers and at ghosting EIs(/TTs) ghost hammers takes the lead.


    4. Simming:
    a chance for everyone to grow faster empire. A lot more calculation oriented now than it was money oriented.


    5. Ghost Hammers:

    Faster TS. Not sure if it completely brings them back or not - but EIs ghost could be awesome now again.


    6. Off Planners:

    While higher TS makes it possible to have more shenanigans for OCs, it's gonna be a headache for DCs.


    That's all I remember - moreover I'm tired from writing. I think there was more to it.


    i just want u to know i have no prob with u not knowing good English but don't act smart and use stuff i said that u don't even understand to try to hurt me bro

    Post was edited 1 time, last by fnx ().

  • This is gonna be my rundown of the upcoming changes, that we all have been waiting for, mostly because it’s gonna shake up a couple of things.


    Tl;dr at the bottom :3


    Link to the upcoming changes: [COM] Balance changes



    Let’s get started!


    • ECs training requirement is now a lvl 15 academy, up from 5
    • RCs training requirement is now a lvl 15 academy, up from 5
    • SRs now carry 75 ress, down from 115


    The academy changes to the tier 3 horses for the Roman and Egyptian tribes seems like a placebo nerf to me, it’s not gonna change playstyle much, as none of them were being trained early on anyway, and it might help new players understanding that both troop units are late game troops.


    Steppes being able to carry less makes a lot of sense, Huns were abusing them since release, due to the low training costs, high atk power and amazing at raiding, so I personally love this change!



    Hero items!


    Nerfing hero strength by reducing the impact of weapons, the shield and armors in the early game, while buffing them in the late game..And moving the spawn days of new hero tier items forward. CP helmet and artworks cooldown.


    Nerfing heroes in the early game means that heavy gold users won’t be able to train their hero by clearing oases as easy as they are now, as they will need a lot more oints to keep him/her healthy. So I am expecting the oints price to increase on competitive servers, while it wont make much of a difference on smaller/less competitive servers.


    Buffing items in the late game is another placebo change, as it won’t make a difference at all, having an extra 3k FS on your hero will make no difference when the Tier 3 items get released, not even now that we are gonna be getting the items quicker.


    CP helmet changes won’t change much, only useful one is tier 1, which isn’t recieving a buff.


    Artworks getting the same cooldown as the bucket is a huge change in the game, as it was one of the biggest ways for heavy gold users to get an advantage in the early game compared to everyone else. Will have to play a server with this change in place, to see how big of an effect it will have.



    Hero resource production:


    Nerfing the egyptian hero, by buffing all other heroes.


    This change do make a lot of sense, seeing it as they are nerfing the fighting strength in the early game, so it will be more difficult to clear oases, so I believe we will see less early game raiding, and more simming, especially now that hero resource bonus have been buffed. Maybe they should look into nerfing the Egyptians Waterworks if they feel like the Egyptians are overpowered ;) Cut the bonus it give at later levels, don’t up the building cost.



    Alliance bonuses:


    Buffing Philosophy and commerce and lowering the early game costs of the required ress to unlock a bonus.


    I like the buff to Philosophy, as it was straight up bad before this change, haven’t really looked at the numbers too much yet, but I think it will make Philosophy a viable alliance bonus to donate to in future rounds, due to the buff and the artworks nerf. Gotta maximize our CPs gains!


    Not sure commerce was in need of a buff? It was already a really good bonus...But it looks like TG is slowly backtracking a bit on their original idea about the alliance bonuses, which I believe was that the ally bonuses was not something that should be easy to get, but would be a bonus to the alliances who work together, would be able to achieve and enjoy.


    ...Which leaves me to the buff to all the alliance bonuses by reducing the costs in the early game.


    Not sure where I should start really, guess I can start with “Why TG, why???”


    I know it was suggested by a lot of people, but the changes seem like an overkill to me.

    I think they should look into lowering the daily donation cap if they don’t intend to nerf the bonuses in the future.


    May aswell just lower training times and smithy upgrades instead of the new changes to the ally bonuses imo.



    Brewery:


    Buff, buff, buff!


    Not much to say really, a pretty decent buff to teutons, maybe more people will look into using brewery for other things than ramming a WW.


    The overall building costs seem alright to me, will have to play a round to see how it’s gonna affect gameplay.


    I can however still don’t see anything about being able to build Brewery when only having GGs in your village, instead of being forced to have a regular Granary to build it. TG please fix.



    Trade Office:


    Was it really needed? It will be easier to move ress around, not sure it was an issue prior to this change?



    Tournament Square:


    Gotta go fast! Even less sleep!


    At first thought I like this change since it wilm give defender less time to react to incoming, and the defender is right now the one with the advantage. So I like this change, will have to test it on a server to see how much it will affect gameplay.



    Tl;dr

    Read everything, if you are interested.



    Formatting on phone is literally non existent on the forum after the update, so I hope that it was somewhat readable.


    Also, I feel like there was something missing from the changes...The Gauls.


    My rundown is built up a bit differenly thoughout it, feel free to let me know which way you prefer :)

    Post was edited 1 time, last by Lemon ().

  • Yes I was going to write about many of these things too but my time and motivation is limited. Thanks for filling in, good points.


    Ameno May I ask what was intended with this change? More skirmish? Please, ask your community what would be the best way to achieve the goals you set. Make a poll or something and let there be some discussion about it. I'd be happy to give you more views about any change proposed. But this TS buff is way too much. It most likely doesn't affect the game as intended and has terrible strategical consequences that can't be avoided.

    Zioe | WILD | com1 2013

    The Stranger | GOATS | com1 2014

    SuperAidMinion | WILD | com5 2014

    OswaldCobblepot | SGR | com1 2016-2017

    Random Variable | SGR | com1 2018 + many other servers


    aka. Valt

  • @mods: Are what we discussing just something among us? so that we talk about the implications rather than complain? or do what we say is going to make it to TG's ears so that we explain what stuffs are wrong and what has to be addressed etc from a very experienced player perspective?

    Our only recourse is the exact same as yours. I.e. passing it along to the CM for inclusion in their weekly report.


    =\

  • Alright, I posted on the anglosphere forums, but there's no active discussion there, so I'm gonna post my thoughts here. I agree with a lot of you. And Wulfr101 that's a great analysis of the issues with the TS change.


    -----------------------


    Allow me to say that I'm really not a fan of the way these changes were done. They came out without any discussion, communication, or warning (unless, as usual, it was only done on tournament servers). Suddenly, the whole game is being rebalanced despite any serious complaints about game balance. I think there a bunch of good changes in here, but I think there some seriously game damaging ones as well. Like, we need a serious discussion about some of these and I'd like to see some feedback considered before they are rolled out. Here's my opinion:


    The good


    Art cooldowns. This shrinks the spend gap (a little bit). I can be a fan of that.


    Additional, hidden ranks. As a data lover, this is awesome, and I can't wait to see this.


    The bad


    Philosophy and Commerce. The basic %buff is the wrong way to go about rebalancing these. Philosophy and Commerce were useless compared to Recruitment and Metallurgy because they don't upgrade troops. These two needed a rework in mechanics, just making them a bigger % isn't going to solve the underlying problem.


    Alliance bonus costs. Why? They were very well balanced before. You hit 10% in the two that matter around day 150-170 on a normal server. Now people are gonna be pounding them out super early and then they fade away because once players finally have incredible amounts of extra res, everything worthwhile will be maxed out.


    Hero resource bonuses. This just will boost the cost of ointments more. Money grabbing move, but fine, I get it. You have to run a business.


    The very bad



    Trade Office. This is just bad. I don't understand why we would do this. Increase merchant capacity if anything. Or merchant speed. The trade office had it's place before, making it even more important isn't the way to go. The market on it's own is now essentially nothing. Not only that, but on small maps you can now pretty much trade route as much as you want to anywhere on the map. Seriously. With now up to 150% from commerce and 800% for Roman merchants, the max size is now 225000 resources per 20 merchants. This is just stupid.


    Brewery. Teutons were already the strongest. Why are we just ham-fisting another 10% tribe-specific boost for literally no reason? At this point, hammers would be stupid not to play Teut.


    Tournament Square. No one wants the game to be faster. This is probably my least favorite of the changes. I fail to see any reason this should be done, ESPECIALLY now that we have small maps. If people wanted troops to move twice as fast, they should have gone to a speed server. I've never played a speed before. But now it seems that ALL servers are about to be 2x speed. Thanks for giving us choices TG. It should be noted that this is also a very offense-heavy bonus. Defense usually walks maybe 50 squares while offense walks well over 100. If you have something normal like TS 20 for a hammer and TS 10 for an anvil villa, with a 150 square walk for cats and 50 square walk for def these are the equivalent distances.


    Old-> Cats: 63.3 Defense: 35

    New-> Cats: 46 Defense: 30


    The difference changes from almost 30 fields to 16. Not to mention that ghosts are now indestructible. From 100 squares, a 2x speed EI ghost is now around 1 hour. If you don't have enough defense within 7 squares to stop 40k EI, there's nothing to do. And unless you're an anvil, that's not gonna happen. Even PDs are usually have most of their def over 7 squares. A few timed scouts and you can now guarantee that a ghost will survive a cross-quad plonk.


    Summary



    Huge pointless buff for the already strongest tribe

    Defense gets much less time to react.

    We are buffing merchants and alliance bonuses in the wrong way.

  • Hi. I'll forward your feedback, ofc. From the past experience I can confirm that threads like that with constructive ideas are always interesting for the dev team and they read them with great attention.

    Ameno.png
    When you contact me via PM, please, send your messages in English.

  • Hey svenie, good to see you’re still around!


    I guess I am a yes, but I believe the Huns deserve it because the playstyle is so much more skillbased.


    Does this balacing mean we will see Egyptians/Huns at next years TT?


    Hey Heintje, likewise!


    Well I personally think the Steppes were the choice that most people made. I mean they're fast, farm very good, are cheap (a lot easier to build in Great Stables), and also just good attack power.

    So you can build them a lot earlier to start raiding and you'll be better off then Marauders.

    Now maybe more people will take Marauders.

  • Seeing that Doge picture on your sig reminds me of Alex :( (MouseKeyboard)


    Too bad he's not on the forums anymore :(



    Edit: Baited LUL .. I'm sure that SOB is lurking somewhere :P

    Yes, I've built my fair share of WWs. Won a few, lost a few. Played far too many rounds for far too long. Made a lot friends and enemies.


    Yes, I've played as an anvil and as a hammer. I'm only playing now because of all the friendship I have built over the past ten years. I love Travian but I love the community even more.


    Envy me for I have everything, Fear me for I have nothing to lose.


    The one and only, Teutobod.

  • as an 3x player i find tournament square buff absolutly ridiculous and total overkill for no reason. so now cross-quad wars, are brought to completly another lvl, and the deciding factor is who owns more offs and speed artifacts, since deffense which is 30-40+ fields away becomes irrelevant. let me just give an example: with small boots and ts lvl 20, katas travel distance of 200 fields in around 3h10. so that means all roman deffers who are farther than 30 fields are excluded if response is isntant - which isnt. so basicaly if you own small/unique boots artifact, your attacks cross-quad are practically impossible to defend. only positive thing about this that i see: a bit more fight for speed artifacts and ops to steal them, but even tho, what does it take to move small artifacts? 500k res and 20 gold, not much. so this just brings more unbalance in the game, and put completly new level of luck depending on where the speed artis spawn.

  • I personally like the Teuton change on the 5 tribe servers. Huns are OP in my opinion, so the SR nerf was great. They are faster than TT's, carry more, and attack like EIs for less cost. This is a good change.


    The brewery set up allows us to create some interesting strategies using multiple tribes (this format will not just be in Pandora I'm guessing going forward). The brewery change isn't to make maces better -- it's so a Roman can run it with Imps or other strategies.

  • I personally like the Teuton change on the 5 tribe servers. Huns are OP in my opinion, so the SR nerf was great. They are faster than TT's, carry more, and attack like EIs for less cost. This is a good change.


    The brewery set up allows us to create some interesting strategies using multiple tribes (this format will not just be in Pandora I'm guessing going forward). The brewery change isn't to make maces better -- it's so a Roman can run it with Imps or other strategies.

    Not faster than TTs.

    Hey Heintje, likewise!


    Well I personally think the Steppes were the choice that most people made. I mean they're fast, farm very good, are cheap (a lot easier to build in Great Stables), and also just good attack power.

    So you can build them a lot earlier to start raiding and you'll be better off then Marauders.

    Now maybe more people will take Marauders.

    More people will switch to "hamvil" type at start, as fnx pointed out. Marks are still cheaper than TTs, higher attack, higher raid and and fast at 16 speed and have defense capability. But I guess I should shutup now 'cause someone will whine that theyre so OP.

    ..And that is the Final Word.


  • Our only recourse is the exact same as yours. I.e. passing it along to the CM for inclusion in their weekly report.


    =\

    Hi. I'll forward your feedback, ofc. From the past experience I can confirm that threads like that with constructive ideas are always interesting for the dev team and they read them with great attention.

    This is good enough for us. If they can hear us - it makes sense to discuss the implications:
    I'd like to summarize/emphasis on some of the posts I read here and add to it a very good Tournament Square suggestion from BlackBlade who can't post right now since he's busy, but in 2 days we should expect a detailed post from him. I didn't get permission from him either for sharing this - but I hope he does not mind. All credits given.


    Items = none. It's a change to nerf the early game and affects every players equally. Change to artwork is liked by everyone.


    Units = While a lot of players approached the nerf as a required one for Huns, 3 players had different Views. Final Word , wishmaster3 and me fnx  :P

    I proceeded with a more detailed analysis of the troop. Huns (by off players) was picked up specifically for this one troop. Did this troop require a nerf? As FW mentioned, this tribe was not OP. It had a good raiding unit due to which this tribe was played. Huns hammer of Bowmen/SR or Mercenary/SR is as strong as an Imp/EI hammer, and weaker than club/axe/tk, Huns Marauder hammers and finally Imperians/ECs hammers.

    Now - there's no incentives to play this tribe as pure off. With the buff to brewery of teutons - this tribe is only fit for hamvil players. (can explain if someone wants)

    Suggestion: Increase the cost of SRs instead of lowering the raid capacity - this troop is not played by simmers. Simmers prefer Marauder due to higher off power generation. This is a raiding unit - nerfing the raid capacity of this troop will make sure nobody builds SRs and switch to the Marksman for raiding or Marauders for better hammers.


    Alliance Bonus = mostly good reviews. One complained about the low price - but talking from experience of wing-leading 2 rounds with this bonuses, it's a good change. Bonuses should end by the arties time if possible - after arties there's never resources to be spent on bonuses.


    Brewery = Please read the details of my brewery analysis in previous post. I do believe end-game hammers required a buff, but brewery might be a little too strong of a buff since it effects the mid-game more than it does the late game.


    Tournament Square= I'd like to mention BlackBlade idea that he mentioned in our spam room. He'll post it himself in 2 days with more details - but I'd like you mods to include it in your reviews please. As Wulfr mentioned in details about the def players struggles, but on the contrary I liked this idea since it can bring into play off ops against players in boonies who sim their wwks and park them in wwks. So BlackBlade mentioned a compromise, the TS affects 200% till 50 or 100 blocks (70 better imo), and onwards it gets buffed to 400%.

    So, no TS by 20, 200% till 70, and 400% onwards.

    Comparison:

    Old System of 200% catauplts travel time of 100 blocks = 6.6hrs + 8.8hrs = 15.4hrs

    Suggested System of another checkpoint for TS: Catapults travel time of 100 blocks = 6.6hrs + 5.5hrs + 2 = 14hrs 6mins

    New being implemented System of 400% catapults travel time of 100 blocks = 6.6hrs + 5.3hrs = 12hrs

    This is change is more pronounced when we go further out. But all the catapult attacks up to the 70 fields will be the same time of: 12hrs 10mins and then get buffed onwards. It's a great to have two checkpoints instead of 1.


    Trade Office + Commerce Buffs

    Everyone I believe agreed that this was not a required change at all. This is a change only towards ROA servers where multiple bases are built, in normal com servers this only buffs the wonder and removes the strategic aspects of raising the wonder and makes it all about shipment of the resources.


    Statistics: Barely anyone commented on it. Most of us here are not playing the special server to know what exactly we getting into.


    i just want u to know i have no prob with u not knowing good English but don't act smart and use stuff i said that u don't even understand to try to hurt me bro