Upcoming Ambassador workshop #8: Tribe Balancing

  • Dear Community,

    The next ambassador workshop topic is going to be

    Tribe Balancing.

    In this thread you are welcome to discuss these and give some feedback.

    Tell me what you think about the current balance, what you think needs to be fixed or do you have any suggestions? We all know how tricky this subject is and how easy it is to think about this only from your favourite tribe point of view but we are looking for solutions that could make game experience and balance a bit better than it´s now.

    Remember also, that there are

    3 tribe servers (Romans, Gauls, Teutons) and

    5 tribe servers (Romans, Gauls, Teutons, Huns, Egyptians)

    By giving your feedback in this thread, I can forward your opinions in this Workshop and discuss them with developers.

    ...I'm already under your skin 'cause I'm the big bad wolf, now let the games begin.

    Stars can't shine without darkness

  • Some on-the-fly thoughts from someone who has played alot of 3 tribe 3x speed servers, with one 5 tribe 5x server and one Codex Victoria.

    The overall balance of the 3 original tribes is pretty good. Some tweaks might be welcome, but not very drastic changes. These are some points that might be discussed:

    TLDR: Buff roman deff, nerf teuton deff, make new building for gauls.

    - The gauls unique building is just not worth building for most players, while the teuton and roman unique buildings are super useful. Suggestion: Rework the gaul unique building.

    - Romans are (in my opinion) outclassed defensively by the two other tribes, while not having a clear edge over teutons in offense. Legos and EC are not worth building for defensive purposes. Throw a shit tier wall into the mix and its not looking good. Prets are crop efficient, but miss out on too mutch action, without having the stats to make up for it. Cav-heavy romans hammers are plentyful, and the gaul phala/druid and teuton spear/palladin mix already have decent anti-inf capabilities. Suggestion: Buff prets baseline speed by 1.

    - The teuton has two weaknesses: late-game raiding and crop-heavy off (if you go the club route). In every other area they excel. Most ress- and trainingtime efficient offensive troops, (arguably) the best unique building, best wall, and an infantery and cavalery deffensive unit that are both very capable. There is something about the totalt package that is just a bit too mutch imo. If one wants to have a rock-scissor-paper mentalty where teuton are the best offensive, gaul are the best defensive and roman is second best at both, then i think a spearman nerf is the way to go. Maybe take 5 anti-cav points off, or take 5 off both anti-inf and anti-cav.

    5-tribe servers are another story. Huns are a fun and not OP alternative to teutons, i especially like that you have some real multi-purpose units. Egyptians however are just straight up broken. The Ash Wardens are basicly more ress-and training time effecient prets, with 1 higher base speed, with the best cavalery deffensive unit to boot. Add a 32 fields/hr (on 3x servers) deffensive unit you can raid with, an OP wall, pluss a busted early-deff unit and you have a very decent defensive tribe.

    Its the waterworks that makes it really broken, and it gets more broken the better the account is. Here are some scenarios, all with an average of lvl 10 waterworks and 25%+25% oasis in all of your non-cap villages:

    1. "The average Joe". You have some experience, some activity and use some gold. You can have a lvl 18 100% 15c capital and 20 villages. You now have 157K ress more than any other tribe, amounting to 5,7 villages of Ash Warden, or 8900 Ash Wardens pr day.

    2. "The veteran". You have a dual or two, are active for most of the day, most days, and use a decent amount of gold. You secured a 125% capital, and manage to squeez out 30 villages. If you played any other tribe, you would stop at lvl 19 fields, but since the ROI is only marginally lower on lvl 20 fields for you than lvl 19 is for everyone else, you go lvl 20 fields. You now have 288k ress more than any other tribe, amounting to 10,4 villages of Ash Warden, or 16400 Ash wardens per day.

    3. "The sweat-shop". You play with 4+ duals, keep 24/7 activity and use A LOT of gold. As usual you get a 150% 15c, and make 45 villages. The ROI of lvl 21 fields (!) is closer to lvl 19 than lvl 20 for a non-egyptian, so you go for it. You now have 432K more ress pr hr more than any other tribe, amounting to 15.7 villages of Ash Warden, or 24600 Ash Wardens per day.

    Nox 1-3: sindre_er Nox 4: Julenissen Nox 5: Rex lars Nox Nox 6: Balder Nox 7: HoodStar Nox 8: Dead Rabbits ---> Dumino Nox 9: TerrorRegimet Nox 10: MassDestruction Nox 16: Tibbers on Duty Nox 22: MassDestruction---> Nordic Nox 24: Mira Nordicx 1: Jackal Nordicx 3: Frank the Tank Nordicx 4: Tachanka Nordicx 7: Maestro Nordicx 8: Kaid

  • I would like to start this off by saying I have never played with all 5 races.
    I strictly play the "normal" worlds with romans, gauls and teutons and I have no favorite tribe (I like to swap a bit in every premade)

    Teutons with brewery will almost always trade evenly (res wise) even if you hardwall them, cuz of the insane bonus' they get with brewery + hero boost and toss in hospital on the new servers.. and you will see teutons rotate 3-4 hammers. Some kind of tweak towards this is needed imo otherwise many alliances will run out of def pretty fast.

    Def teutons is kinda balanced imo and you just spam spears :D

    I like romans a ton, but I think you should tweak prets travelspeed, or/and production times, or tweak legs and make them viable as well? Cuz in this moment in time prets can never make it to any def calls if you are not placed very close like in the grayzone.
    They got no real other option with def because both horses are strictly made for off.

    Gauls is the go to defensive tribe. Spam Phalanx every day.. and druids with their speed can reach everything, and I think the balance here is okay because of the productiontime of druids.
    You could tweak some numbers to make gauls viable as off accs also? Could be attackpower/productiontime/ new gaul bonus building as sindre_er_NO talked about? I agree 100% trapper is useless compared til romans and teutons bonus building.

  • I have proposed these multiple times but let's give it one more go so I can say that atleast I tried my best.. Two posts above are great suggestions in my opinion and would like to expand them with my own two cents.

    Egypt is a crazy tribe, doesnt matter whatever TG keeps telling that "they are not as good as everyone thinks". For waterworks my proposal is and has been that instead of doubling every single oasis bonus, it should double only 25% bonuses to 50% and be capped at that. It will be useless for 150% capitals but the main aim would be the freedom to settle even those 75% croppers and turn them into 150% + focus more heavily on feeders with oases to get extra production from them. Simple enough?

    And for gauls.. I think the tournament square buff was introduced to have more action on the large 801x801 maps but then someone decided that smaller domains would move to smaller 401x401 maps anyway on top of that. Now that every domain is moving to the small 401x401 map and maps will be really crowded, maybe we could test moving back to the old tournament square or somewhere between the old and current? But, for gauls, their new very special building could be something to buff their tournament squares back to the current levels. Gauls' thing has always been the speed of their troops and what else would fit that better than a special tournament square?